Marie Sola sits down with sex trafficking survivor and Daughter of Change Catherine Ann Wilson of Stop Trafficking US to discuss how she is working to combat the issue of sex trafficking and child sexual abuse.
Marie Sola sits down with sex trafficking survivor and Daughter of Change Catherine Ann Wilson of Stop Trafficking US to discuss how she is working to combat the issue of sex trafficking and child sexual abuse.
Catherine on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherinemossman/
Stop Trafficking US - https://www.stoptraffickingus.org
Support Stop Trafficking US - https://www.stoptraffickingus.org/donations
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/stoptraffickingus/
Instagram: @Stoptraffickingus
Twitter: @StopTraffikinUS
[00:00:00] Hi, everybody, and welcome to this week's Daughters of Change podcast. And today I have in the studio Catherine and Wilson, also known as by her husband, Charlie, the fire pisser.
[00:00:14] You see Charlie, she's [00:00:15] wicked tall. It's so ready weighs. Yeah, I told you I would. She's wicked tall. It's a spirit and indeed.
[00:00:24] And as you'll find out in a second when I read her bio and as we get into the interview, Katherine [00:00:30] is amazing. She is an advocate for keeping our kids safe from sexual abuse. She's an advocate against sex trafficking. And she is on an incredible [00:00:45] journey right now that's just accelerated. And it's a pleasure because I've had the opportunity to see some of this unfold. So with no further ado, I am going to first welcome [00:01:00] Katherine. Katherine, welcome.
[00:01:02] It's a pleasure to be here. Always to be in your presence.
[00:01:05] Oh, back at you, girl. We're like a mutual admiration site. But really, we are simpatico. We really are. We really are. There was a reason that the two of us connected when we did. Yeah. So [00:01:15] I'm going to just take a minute and read your short yet impressive bio and with those impressive glasses. That's right. I'm wearing my dollar store glasses.
[00:01:30] Welcome [00:01:30] to the Daughters of Change podcast. I'm your host. Solar. Each week we'll be bringing you stories from around the globe of the women and girls who are changing the world, each in their own unique way.
[00:01:55] Abused [00:01:45] repeatedly from first grade on for nearly 20 years of her life. [00:02:00] Catherine Anne Wilson spent most of her years from age 12 through 17, living on the street by age 15, starving and desperate. She was lured into sex trafficking, taken in and held against her will by a local pimp after [00:02:15] her escape at age 17. She spent the next 20 years tenaciously seeking various forms of therapy to recover from this trauma. Slowly, tenaciously, she made her way up the ranks to becoming a national [00:02:30] sales manager, earning a six figure income based on 100 percent commission. At age 40, she purchased her Dream Lake house in Maine after finding her own freedom from suffering. Katherine realized that the sexual abuse [00:02:45] and sex trafficking that had claimed her life as a defenseless child was unbelievably still going on, destroying the lives of thousands of children in Maine and other parts of the world today. She founded Stop Trafficking Me, that's [00:03:00] a capital Emmy for Maine, now known as Stop Trafficking US, which is a capital U.S. for the United States, with the goal of stopping Grown-Ups from sexually exploiting children via public and private speaking engagements, social [00:03:15] media, TV, radio and print. Stop Trafficking US works to prevent child abuse. Educating the community on the life cycle of abuse and the horrific domino effect that occurs after a child has been sexually abused [00:03:30] in any way. Katherine was named one of Maine's 2019 outstanding women and was invited by the White House to participate as a survivor representative in its human trafficking roundtable.
[00:03:42] You can find out more information at [00:03:45] Stop Trafficking US dot org. We will get into more of that later in the show and we'll make sure that all of the different ways that you can learn about Catherine and connect with her are in our show notes. So, Catherine, that's a short in terms [00:04:00] of verbiage, but a very long and powerful, powerful resumé. And as I mentioned before, you know, I connected with you early on and I had the I've had the the pleasure of of seeing you just [00:04:15] grow these wings and fly and. Do we we know a lot about your background from the bio. Before we get into sort of the nitty gritty here. What was that that impetus? What was that moment? [00:04:30] As you're you know, you've put your life back together, your professional league. You know, you're really doing really well.
[00:04:37] You're married to a great guy and you decide, OK, I'm leaving this behind. And [00:04:45] now I need to go out and be an advocate.
[00:04:48] What was the impetus for that?
[00:04:50] I wasn't thinking advocate. I just wanted to give back to the community. I moved here from Kansas. You know, I did main Florida. You [00:05:00] know, Maine. Florida as a child, settle down in Kansas and married and had my children got divorced. It was a dream of mine. Had the vision board with the cutting out the pictures and, you know, all that stuff really manifesting. [00:05:15] I want to live back in Maine again. You know, year round. And at 40, as you said, I I was doing really well with my career. I had the money and I moved back to Maine. It was like, yay! Shortly after that, I met my husband. [00:05:30] And around, you know, forty seven years old, I guess I I started the perimenopause when perimenopause happens. It's not just a, you know, a physical buy-out biological thing happening, but you also start thinking about [00:05:45] life and legacy and giving back. And all this stuff starts happening like what's the meaning of life and and how can I be of service in this life? And I've done tons of volunteer work in Kansas, but not a lot in Maine. And [00:06:00] my doctor at the time, she was a nurse practitioner. Marcel Pick, I think that that's her right name with women to women said, you know, you ought to consider working with children. The younger the children are, the more of an impact [00:06:15] you can have on them. And I thought, oh, my gosh, I don't want anything to do with children.
[00:06:20] Oh, that brought them, right? Yeah.
[00:06:25] You know, I didn't really get to have a child that I don't really don't understand. Normal kids. [00:06:30] And then she said, well, I wanted to talk to a friend of mine who works with kids in jail. And so I said, you know, I trusted her and believed in her and said, okay, I'll meet the women. And she told me that there's just one jail for children in the [00:06:45] state of Maine for boys and girls. Long Creek Youth Development Center. And she told me about what what their life was like and that I should, you know, I should go there. So I was really against it, but willing [00:07:00] to follow the women who I respected. So I when I filled out the background information stuff that you have to do before you go in. I met with the volunteer coordinator who wanted to get to know my life story, which really wasn't [00:07:15] something that I told. Like I it's not like I've been out about being sex trafficked all my life. In fact, the vast majority of my friends did not know. The only people who knew most of the story. Not [00:07:30] even all of this story was a need to know basis. It was just, you know, who you're dating needs to know because you start screaming when you have a flashback. And in terror, you know, it's kind of good for them to know why you jumped five feet in the air when they come behind you or whatever. So [00:07:45] they knew. But I hadn't really told the story. And I did that in the volunteer coordinators office. There's about maybe six of them. And they were crying and I didn't really understand why [00:08:00] they were crying. And they asked me if I would do it again the next day. So they brought in another batch of people, including correctional officers, and again, crying. And I I'm not sure what's going on, you know, but I'm just turning it [00:08:15] over to my higher power and saying, OK, well, I'm just going to be really honest and open and figure out what this is all about.
[00:08:22] Come to find out it was the happy ending. You know, the people who do service, who are the first responders, who do the service [00:08:30] work, who are in the trenches. They don't get to see very many happy endings. They don't get to see very many, many happy endings at all. And the fact that I was there, having gone through what I went through as [00:08:45] a child and teenager, they were just thrilled to hear the happy ending. So then I actually went in to jail to meet with the girls. I thought maybe, hey, if my purpose is just to give the volunteer coordinators and correctional [00:09:00] officers that, then great. You know, I go into jail. I freak out. I can't handle it.
[00:09:05] As I was fearing, like my inner freak out when I got to have a panic attack or something, like they shut the door on my.
[00:09:13] Let me out, you know, so [00:09:15] I went in and I met the girls, and instead of it being awkward as I had feared, are freaking me out and in any way. I loved them like the person who was in charge of the girls unit, Beth P.V. [00:09:30] Is a mama bear like you do not you want her in the foxhole with you. She treated the girls on the girls unit as if they were her own. She loved them, discipline them, brought [00:09:45] in every sort of therapy that possible for the girls. And she and I worked together. She picking the girls that she felt would really benefit the most from speaking with me. And I came [00:10:00] once or twice a week for three hours or so at a time. If any of the girls needed time alone with me, then I would come in additional time. And we found the benefit of meeting. [00:10:15] These girls were where they were at. As a survivor, they saw hope. They found hope in me. They disclosed things to me that they would not and weren't disclosing. Some of the girls disclose [00:10:30] stuff that they had been in jail for years and had never told anybody there. The things that they told me. So I. I learned that I and I was blessed with being able to make the girls [00:10:45] feel safe and that I could give them hope. I could inspire them to not let their past be their future. I also was astounded by the amount of sex trafficking. [00:11:00]
[00:11:01] I didn't know what that word even meant sex trafficking like this was new to me. I was a 15 year old prostitute in my mind. I was a 15 year old slave. I mean, this guy wouldn't let me leave, threatened [00:11:15] to kill me, choked me to unconsciousness. You know, rape, though, you know, unbelievable, horrible things. But it wasn't called sex trafficking back when I was doing it.
[00:11:27] So I'm hearing this term, I'm meeting these girls. [00:11:30] I'm having this experience with with the girls. And then I'm learning that one after another after another was engaged in some kind of sex trafficking. Sometimes by their parents, sometimes by their step brothers, [00:11:45] sometimes whatever.
[00:11:46] And I was like, this is insane. Like, does anybody know this is happening?
[00:11:53] And so I started asking questions like, OK, do we have any sex trafficking groups in Maine or are there advocates [00:12:00] doing something? So I joined the York County Coalition Against Sex Trafficking. The Greater Portland Sex Trafficking.
[00:12:10] And, you know, I'm short, although like you said, I'm tall in spirit [00:12:15] and they go all inspired. D-Did Gide 5 feet tall.
[00:12:21] I a zong, you know, I'm, you know, at the time, most perimenopausal and short, though, you know, you don't want to mess with me. Right. And [00:12:30] so I join these these groups tonight.
[00:12:33] And I try, you know, try and just trying to get the lay of the land like who's doing what and what are all the different organizations like even that, you know, the learning curve on. [00:12:45] Okay. So you've got the Department of Health and Human Services. OK. And what did they do? And then you have Mikasa and they're not a service provider. They're more like an informational hub. And then you have what used to be in the 70s, [00:13:00] the rape crisis centers, who over time with different grants have morphed into domestic violence, rape crisis and sex trafficking. OK. And then they say they're in the schools, but there's a lot of schools, not [00:13:15] very many programs. So can you really say that you're, quote, in the schools when you're there once every six months or once a year trying to understand the languaging? And why are they saying that while they're saying that because they can get grants if [00:13:30] they say just trying to, like, put it all together. And right out of the gate, it was I was not well received.
[00:13:39] So you mentioned that. And that's interesting. So I just just want to back up for one second. I want to come back to that just [00:13:45] to point out that the the trajectory of your journey.
[00:13:49] Was something that you didn't really it wasn't planned.
[00:13:54] It was not. There was a seed that something that wanted to give back and you [00:14:00] were brought on the path you're supposed to be on. Exactly. And, you know, telling your story and sharing your story. So this is something I did not know. Catherine, is that you had never shared your story. I had. I. No. So I'm just touching on that because I feel like there [00:14:15] are a lot of doubters, a change out there listening that you have perhaps gone through trauma in their own way and are trying to determine sharing their story can be both cathartic but helpful because, you [00:14:30] know, depending on if somebody is ready for it. But the fact that people were telling young women were telling you things, that they work, going to tell somebody else that they couldn't relate.
[00:14:39] Yeah. And they they didn't tell anybody else. You know, and it's not like they didn't have the opportunity [00:14:45] and the the educated people. There was just a bond from survivor to survivor, which was which is really cool. And then why. While I was at Long Creek and then at the [00:15:00] time that I spent outside of Long Creek joining these organizations and and trying to get educated on, you know, what was what, Christine Thibeault from the Cumberland County District Attorney's Office was asked to speak [00:15:15] at a panel one when Ruchira Gupta came to visit. So the CliffNotes version on which era is she worked with the Clintons, who created the anti-trafficking bill. And I want to say 2002. [00:15:30] So prior to 2002, there was no anti-sex trafficking, anything.
[00:15:35] This is all really new for the country and the world. And people are trying like crazy to catch up. [00:15:45] You know, it's really so she had she said that Retiro was coming to town and actually Kathie Lee from the Lee Automotive family. Kathie Lee is an amazing philanthropic person. Their whole family [00:16:00] is here. And she had created oh, my gosh, I'm not going to say it right. The Women's Justice League. That sounds so Marvel Comics, but something something like that. I'm not I'm not saying it correctly.
[00:16:12] There are heroes in there. They're superheroes in their [00:16:15] own way. I know, right?
[00:16:16] They were totally are. And so Kathy was working with you. Main law to bring in women from all over the world to our local women here in Maine to share [00:16:30] the similarities and how we can support each other and sort of make that bridge. She brought in immigrant women. She brought in Ruchira to talk about sex trafficking. So she set up Recherche to speak at the Wish Kamper campus. That was a private [00:16:45] lecture with panelists, FBI district attorney myself in whichare. We're speaking to about 100 law enforcement people. Then she also spoke at Colby College and then she spoke one [00:17:00] other places. Well. So I was asked because Beth P.V from Long Creek and Christine Thibeault, who works with the juveniles, you know, knew me, had seen what I was doing with the girls there and thought that I [00:17:15] would be a good person to sit on this panel. So I was gonna be outed, not just with the correctional officers and the girls and Long Creek. Now, they want Channel Six, wants to do a news story on me, and I'm being [00:17:30] asked to speak on this panel. So one of the things I did before I agreed to be interviewed by Channel 6 was I called the local sheriff's department and I wanted to find out if my pimp was still alive. Is he [00:17:45] in Mahe mizzy in jail?
[00:17:47] Is he not? It's like wandering around. And I found out that he was alive and well and still living in the same house. Oh, wow. So it's like, OK, well, I want you to know [00:18:00] that if I die, he's probably a good suspect. And then I spoke with my husband and my family and my friends. Like I said, the vast majority of my friends did not know [00:18:15] my story.
[00:18:17] So I wasn't sure how they were going to feel it. And it was a second marriage. And I didn't want to use my laughs. You know, my new last name because I didn't want to shame my [00:18:30] husband's family or have his children be embarrassed. So there are a lot of considerations that needed to be taken into account before I agreed.
[00:18:41] Yeah, absolutely. So I had all those conversations. I [00:18:45] got a green light from not even a hesitation is everybody. He was hugely supportive. Which I was, you know, kinda delighted by, I guess, because now I'm going to have to go.
[00:18:57] I had to do to do that. Did other rubber's going [00:19:00] to hit the road? GIRL Right.
[00:19:01] And so Channel 6 came to Long Creek and they interviewed me there and then they interviewed me and my lake house that I had bought. I I kind of think that Channel 6 wanted to actually see the lake house. Did she really did [00:19:15] she really go from, you know, runaway prostitute to buying a lake house? Yep. Come on over.
[00:19:21] Check it out. So sit on the couch.
[00:19:23] So so they went to both places. And and you know what wove that that video in the interview. And you can see [00:19:30] that on my Web site if anybody wants to see it. You can see the tear in my eyes when when they were interviewing me. And then after that, I I did the Ruchira thing. And right before that, that was [00:19:45] my first. Not everybody's going to like you moment when when we were getting ready for that. There were lots of planners, women in different positions who were organizing and wanted [00:20:00] to meet with me and others to talk about strategy, how that event with Recherche was going to go. And in those meetings, I got the mean girl treatment. Now, I haven't had the mean girl treatment since I was in junior high [00:20:15] school.
[00:20:16] And it was the mean girl treatment. So I'm sitting and and Christine is on the speaker phone. And I'm sitting in this room and I don't want to give too much information away because I just want to be considerate. [00:20:30] Right. Yeah. So I'm sitting in a room and Christine's on speaker phone and I.
[00:20:36] I actually said to one of the ladies there. I said, I did want to make sure that I understand my role in this event properly. [00:20:45] So there's the M.C. Ruchira. And then there's me and Christine and FBI. And I said, I'm getting the vibe that you want me to just really be seen and not heard. And she looked at me with [00:21:00] like steely eyes and said, I think you understand our your position properly.
[00:21:05] Oh, so this goes back to what you were just saying, that you weren't initially received. Oh, not and not even now. I mean, it's really interesting, [00:21:15] you know. What do you what do you feel? So first, why won't you talk a bit about what that is? But what when you think about that, do you think it's that it makes people nervous like that could happen, like he represents how they could happen to them or their children? [00:21:30]
[00:21:30] Well, there's there's so many dynamics involved. A part of it is, you know, my my physiology. You know, if I could have smoked a joint and drank a margarita when I was living through how I would have. It [00:21:45] just didn't it didn't affect me the same. So I'm living on the street. People are drinking, smoking pot, doing drugs. When I tried those things, they did not physically affect me the same way. It made me feel [00:22:00] worse and not better. And feeling worse wasn't something I was into made. You know, like like anything I did was a seriously bad trip, you know. So I just didn't use, you know, I just didn't do the drugs [00:22:15] and alcohol. So I remember every horrific bad thing that's ever been done to me. And then after when I was going through recovery, I could not tolerate anti-anxiety, anti-depression medications [00:22:30] of any kind. So I had to white knuckle, debilitating, horrific post-traumatic stress, night terrors, anxiety, panic.
[00:22:40] Just it was. It was a living hell for me. I wish to [00:22:45] die every day. That's another story.
[00:22:48] So for me, you know, meditation, lots of different kinds of therapy, including working out. I'm telling you this for a reason. So I started [00:23:00] running. I started, you know, training, working out. I've done a couple of marathons. I've done a few triathlons. And then later I was doing a bodybuilding competitions. And really the only read I just tried it [00:23:15] once just to like see. And then I kept doing it because of the camaraderie. Like, the women were so nice to each other. The men weren't hitting on you and the women were kind to each other. I was like, well, that's something new and different. I loved that. [00:23:30] So I did more. So I would when I would do a show, I would put my pictures on Facebook of me in the bikini with that with my other competitors, not as a part, you know, pornography thing, not [00:23:45] nothing sexual about it at all. If I was a volleyball person, I would have been in a similar outfit if I was competitive swimming. It would have been a one piece, but still. Right. And when I was entering [00:24:00] into advocacy work against sex trafficking and child sexual abuse prevention, some other people saw those pictures and they were like, oh, honey, who do you think you are? You needed. You [00:24:15] can't do both and that you're setting a bad example. And I'm thinking, do you know how much therapy it took for me to get comfortable in my own skin? This is a big deal to me. This is me owning my own body. [00:24:30] And and I see myself as an athlete. Other athletes are treating me like an athlete. But my people in the community, some of the people in the community were looking they were looking at it as it was [00:24:45] me sexualizing something. And I had somebody in the governmental position take me out for coffee and say, hey, I want you to take down all those pictures and I don't want you did and gave me a whole list of rules. Not [00:25:00] a good idea. Again, remember, I'm perimenopause, but.
[00:25:05] Does that person still have. Yeah. Oh yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean did you did you rip there. No. I don't remember. Well I did is going on. Oh no I didn't.
[00:25:12] And so what I what I said was and this [00:25:15] was a growing thing for me too. I had to learn to say this. And here's what what I was coached to say. And I loved it. So she's giving me the list of rules of what I'm allowed to do. Now, I don't work for her. I'm [00:25:30] not getting any financial. This isn't my boss. This isn't anybody. This is just a governmental person. And she's laying down the law. If I'm going to fit in to the new world of advocacies here in Maine.
[00:25:44] I said, [00:25:45] I really appreciate you sharing and I will take into consideration everything that you've told me. Beautiful. She did not like that [00:26:00] answer.
[00:26:00] It's a beautiful answer. I love that answer. I do, too.
[00:26:03] And so that I and she would, you know, come a little harder. Maybe you don't understand. I do. I really I you've explained it beautifully. Thank you. I think I fully. And then [00:26:15] I would say repeat back to her what she said.
[00:26:18] Like you do in marriage counseling, the course, of course, that marriage and work. But but do you go to work for this? Right.
[00:26:25] And so I said I understand that you're saying you're saying this. And she [00:26:30] looked at me. Yeah. You and I will take that into consideration. And then I didn't remove anything. You know, and said, hey, this is this is my sport. I'm really proud of it. This organization is taking me under their wings [00:26:45] and I'm proud to be an athlete. And that's what I am. So I think that was a part of the pushback. I I think different. You know, I I I'm not beyond wearing a pink tutu [00:27:00] and Michelle wears it well.
[00:27:03] You know, I have I have a red superhero Cape of Love that when I that went with me to the White House, it was in one of my friends made me a superhero, Cape of Love. And I put it in my purse and [00:27:15] I took it. And I have magic rocks that I have that I put out on a full moon. And I give to people, actually, I gave Senator Collins one of my magic Sebadoh. I live on Sebadoh Lake. There's these rocks that are just beautiful. And they just remind [00:27:30] me of the starfish story that it just takes one.
[00:27:33] And I want people to hold that rock in their hand and just know that you just need to make a difference in one person's life. So I give people rocks. That's kind of weird.
[00:27:42] Well, you know, I walked to the beat of a different. [00:27:45] Yeah, but that's OK, Catherine. Because it gets people to stand up and listen.
[00:27:48] And and when I remember when you were going through that.
[00:27:54] And may I just add that Katherine was like winning in [00:28:00] the bodybuilding at 50. Yeah. Hey, we're not that to me with the message there. Timmy was so positive and amazing and the message that I instinctually felt.
[00:28:15] Catherine [00:28:15] feels like she owns her own body now. That was that was me, it felt like you had worked through something huge by being able to do that. And, you know, people still well-meaning, not well-meaning, want to [00:28:30] still put women in boxes in a lot of different ways. My guess is just throwing it out there, if you are a man doing bodybuilding, you probably would not have had the same backlash. Right. And again, I don't want to get into us against them. It's just it's just what it is. And [00:28:45] so all that happened. Yeah. However, let's talk about the trajectory things are taking now because you stuck. You stayed true to yourself. I did. You've stayed your path. And if you don't mind, I'd like to hit [00:29:00] upon some of these achievements that have just happened in like the past six months, for heaven's sakes. First of all, you had the Keeping Main Children's Safe conference. That that was amazing. And I would say [00:29:15] that happened back in September. Karen, was it October, September, mid-September, mid-September? So before we get into the other strides that came right on the heels of that. I know that you had a huge community collaboration [00:29:30] that you spearheaded with sponsors and lawmakers, and you brought in a very well-known speaker on the subject, Victor Veith. Yeah. Victor Veith. So tell us a little bit about that conference, [00:29:45] what it was that you did because it was free and you also offered CEO use and educational credits. So over 80 law enforcement officers in Maine when educated at that conference, which is huge. Talk a little bit about putting that together [00:30:00] and what the end result was. And then I want to get in to a couple other things that happened right on the heels. Yeah.
[00:30:06] So so so the nonprofit is five years old now. And so I had that experience early on. And what I did was I just took [00:30:15] it upon myself to educate people. I believe in human beings. I believe in the people in Maine. And what I believed to be true was that they just didn't understand what the word sex trafficking even meant. They didn't understand the cause and effect. If we look at the social [00:30:30] ills in our community, kids dropping out of school, kids incarcerated, addictions, bullying, a high suicide rate, sex trafficking, the sexual exploitation of kids, pornography, all these things. When we [00:30:45] look at all of those things, we think of them as individual when really that when we follow each one of those things down to their genesis where they started from. Eighty nine percent of all of those different issues that the people who are suffering from all those [00:31:00] different issues were sexually abused as a kid. So it was like I believe that if the people in Maine only knew what sex trafficking is, where it came from, how the whole thing stems back from the abuse and neglect of our children, they will [00:31:15] rally. So all I got to do is educate the 1.3 million people in the state of Maine. OK, let's do this. You know, so Rotary was amazing. Churches, organizations, women's groups, business groups all [00:31:30] over. I spoke to thousands of people. And I I kept the constant question was, how can I reach more? How can I do better? So I collaborated with Dering high school and where a bunch of kids put on a performance around [00:31:45] what sex trafficking is, followed by a panel discussion thinking that every high school in the state of Maine would follow suit.
[00:31:53] That didn't work. That was a huge success covered by all the all the local news stations. We had over 100 people showed up, but [00:32:00] it didn't it didn't catch fire like I had hoped it would. All right. What else can we do? I would get asked to speak as a individual speaker like Knights of Columbus, for instance, and the Eskimo Club and International Women's Club. Quickly, [00:32:15] I learned that if I got asked to be a speaker, I would say, hey, I want to make you look like a rock star in your organization. Let's open up to invite the spouses of the people and you can meet your surrounding community and what other [00:32:30] affiliations you have. Let me bring my dream team. Jonathan Skarbek is the Cumberland County district attorney. He came to anything and everything I asked him to are. Peter Jim Marzio, the Homeland Security victim's assistant [00:32:45] agent for all of New England. He would come. Jennifer Wiesner, healthy sexuality, helping people understand about children. So I would have my little dream team and we would speak for the military, would speak to Rotary, would speak where ever. And then [00:33:00] I said, okay, most conferences are vocationally focused. So all the doctors will have their annual conference. First responders have their end of annual conference. Social workers have their annual conference. And like, you know, your. Preaching to the choir [00:33:15] at these conferences, we need to have a conference for our community. And Christine Thibeault from the assistant D.A. for Cumberland County working with juveniles, said, you know what, Catherine? Victor Veith is the best speaker [00:33:30] I have ever heard in all my years in service. So I called Victor a year ago and I said, hey, I'm one person, really one person.
[00:33:41] And no money. All right.
[00:33:43] What can I do? He said, well, he's [00:33:45] a winner is the best time. He's in Minnesota. When's the best time to come in Maine? I'm like, September, man. September is the best time, a year to be here. So we set the date. And he said, Catherine, this should really be a three day faith based conference. And I'm thinking [00:34:00] I'm a spiritual mutt.
[00:34:03] I'd like that. A spiritual. I'm a spiritual. A lot of people are doing well.
[00:34:07] And I'm thinking, you know, how am I going to get people to come? Well, he wanted me to do a faith based conference because [00:34:15] the faith based organizations are where the predator offenders are flocking to because it's low hanging fruit. They have they can get access to whole group kids right there. So that's why he wanted to do that. That's scary. And so, you know, the [00:34:30] deal with conferences is they're usually out of the state. They're usually really expensive and they're usually during the week. So I'm like, let's do Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Thursday. We can educate law enforcement, whatever.
[00:34:44] Saturday, it'll [00:34:45] be families. And let's let's.
[00:34:49] What would be an incentive to bring the men see use every fertile U.S.O. for people that don't know if there's a continuing education credit? OK. So if you're a therapist, [00:35:00] if you're a firefighter, if you're a lawyer, you have to take so many classes that offer these continuing education credits in order to keep your license. OK. It's a different thing for military. So the the victims assault, [00:35:15] sexual assault leaders within the military, they have a different kind of credit. Lawyers have a different kind of credit that they get. But Ingrid Petit on my board, she worked it out with the University [00:35:30] of New England, our military folks. Kartikeya was like all over the military to get the credits there. You made law also offered credits. So now we just needed to try to try to create collaboration [00:35:45] instead of competition among the advocacies. So we went out saying, hey, do you guys want to participate with us? So the main child advocacy centers, Children's Trust, for example, made Resilience Building Network all [00:36:00] collaborated with us. 19 Oaks Marketing was hugely beneficial. Meg Hach, by the way, from child advocacy centers. Huge help. Shay Bela's huge help. Heather Burke A huge help. Ingrid Petti Huge [00:36:15] help.
[00:36:15] And so we were just as little handful of people. Clarkes Insurance gave us a nice donation. Moodies Collision. akkari Beauty in Portland. Portland Pump Company. They gave us donations and slowly [00:36:30] and JAG gave us a $5000. Its juvenile assistant fund gave us $5000. So we raised the $25000. The First Baptist Church in Portland [00:36:45] gave us the venue. We hired Gina and their Red Eye flight crew for a Friday night band. We had food trucks and it was it was just. People said it was the best conference they had ever been. And it was free. [00:37:00] It was it was Ari. It was for a huge audience. And we did see it. So were this use. So I wanted to just once, just like show them what can be done when we all pull together and make and make this happen. So [00:37:15] it was we had DeKlerk is one of the speakers, Victor Veith and Pete Singer. We had a bill this year from Lewiston who spoke. We had somebody from the Maine Children's Trust speak. So it was really a huge success and I'm very proud of that. So [00:37:30] will I ever do a three day conference again?
[00:37:33] No. Well, but you set you set the bar. I mean, you set a precedent or you also put, if you will, a business, a model, a model of what can be done. Absolutely. Yeah. And if there wasn't it is it so you know, [00:37:45] I'm a little tiny nonprofit. You know, I am I am seriously. Or I am told I am out of it.
[00:37:50] I am one one person with a board who does amazing admin stuff. We're just there. There could not do [00:38:00] this without them. My husband has been the bank for stop trafficking U.S. I'm so little. I'm not getting funding. I did apply for a $10000 grant through one of the organizations that I won't say the name of in Maine. And [00:38:15] they denied me the money because they said edgy. They believed that education would not stop a predator from sexually abusing a kid. I'm like, oh, my gosh, this is the level of ignorance we have here. We have got [00:38:30] to like get this conference going. We've got. Educate our people here. And by the way, David Finkel, whore out of the University of New Hampshire is a world known researcher. If you take any sort of class on. Perversion, [00:38:45] you know, abuse. You're going to read his his research. He's him. And right here at the University of New Hampshire, when he found out that I was denied that grant because of they didn't believe in education, I was [00:39:00] doing an interview of him for something else. And he gave me a three minute soundbite on his own. Just went into this whole little talk on how important education is in the world of prevention, really. I'm like, let [00:39:15] is snip that out and put that on my Web site. Not as a mañana, Nanao, but just like Mahidol need to understand the need to understand that that it's not a mean. This is essential. Prevention is essential.
[00:39:29] So the education [00:39:30] is absolutely real vital. Yeah, it is vital. And again, you know, if you go to what you found early on, if you followed this chain down, all it starts with early childhood lutely use and how and I find it with a lot of issues. [00:39:45] The funding isn't typically always there for awareness. It's there for the other things, you know. And so to have people like you on the ground that not only have the passion to do this and the tenacity [00:40:00] to make it happen, but you come from it from a standpoint of having lived it. Right. And I think that there's something that, you know.
[00:40:09] There's something.
[00:40:12] The people that have been through something that are then going [00:40:15] back to advocate for that very something. There's something that they bring to the table that nobody else can bring to the table. And I I really feel like people should stop and listen. So the White House thinks so for we talk about the White House. I would like to also bring up [00:40:30] the fact, because we're talking about this this trajectory that you're on, that's just like the snowball is going. So you have this really successful conference. Then you find out that you're you've been chosen as one of the 20 outstanding women in Maine by the [00:40:45] Portland Radio Group, which is, if not the biggest, one of the biggest radio groups in the state. So you found that out. You had you had a sash and everything. I've seen the photos, right. So whatever vanes, 20 outstanding women. So think [00:41:00] about that from being not, you know, from having people tell you to just be seen and not heard. Well, hello. Guess what? She's being seen and heard. So that must have felt wonderful.
[00:41:13] It was weird. It [00:41:15] felt really awkward. And I think it's really interesting. I think they're it. It was a weird mental thing that happened when I found out that I was one of the 20 women. I was so excited to have the opportunity to [00:41:30] promote the conference. And when I found out that we weren't going to be doing the live interviews and all that until after the conference, I I didn't want anything to do with it because [00:41:45] I don't want attention on me. I want anything that I do. I wanted it to be an opportunity to educate people. And I thought, well, how you know, how am I going to, you know, be of of serve as how can I? I don't want the [00:42:00] I don't want. Yay, Catherine. So that was a little bump that I had to get over.
[00:42:05] And then it was like, OK, this is the Portland Radio Group. I love Eeva. Blake is just an amazing guy. The Portland Radio Group does so much for our [00:42:15] community. You just put your little attitude away, put you, you know, put your sparkly shoes on, which I did. Of course you did. And.
[00:42:22] And let's put on something hot pink and go, yeah, well, you know, but you are doing something, Kathryn, because what you're doing, just like being here on this podcast [00:42:30] today is showing other people, other women and other people. What somebody can do as one person if they really want to. And it's it's actually there's a role model aspect there that's really, really important. [00:42:45] And I feel like, you know, for Daughters of Change, that's one of the reasons I do this, because I want to be able to tell the stories of women and girls like you who are making change in the world that other women can relate to, as in other people, you know, other men, too. That's my daughter. That's my wife. [00:43:00] That's me. That's my that's my sister. Yeah. That helps to inspire other people to do something.
[00:43:06] And I'm I was inspired by the women that were there. Right. Like, we all sort of felt that way when we were all like on this stage. And somebody said, [00:43:15] I feel really awkward and somebody. Yeah, I feel really. And so we all sort of felt the same way. We we are the givers in our community. And we didn't want the light shown on us. It was really a beautiful thing. And what we were [00:43:30] how what we did with it was we networked and we learned about each other and what each other was doing. And that helped us deal with the spotlight on us. But it was of interest. And I'm just, you know, telling you the truth. You [00:43:45] know, we were all sort of not wanting the spotlight on us. And I found that really interesting. It also made me think about women in general, how we don't celebrate ourselves. And that really I mean, that was really stuck [00:44:00] out for me, like.
[00:44:02] Somebody said, don't you celebrate? Like, did I celebrate the success of the conference? No. Did I celebrate the 20 women you get? No. Did I celebrate? I went to then. I'm on the next yang. And so moving [00:44:15] into 2020, I wrote this down and I actually reached out to my girlfriends and said, look, I can't do this just for me, but could we get together and have on soul sundaes? Can we can really get together and celebrate whatever the [00:44:30] successes are. And there's this comparison like, well, I can't say that I went to the White House and even with the abuse and the advocacy work survivors. Well, I only had this bad thing. I only was raped once. And you were raped 10 times.
[00:44:44] So, [00:44:45] like, no. Stop that comparison. You know, we all and let's celebrate the tiniest little thing. You know, I didn't kick the dog today. So what? Yay!
[00:44:56] You know, your name was Riley. It's two things that actually tie in. If [00:45:00] you read about even women in business, it's imposter syndrome like, you know. Right. I'm not exactly. I'm not Rutelli therapy WebM. And and I'm not wanting to to promote yourself. And I don't mean that in a self-serving way, but not wanting to put yourself out [00:45:15] front. Right. Because you just don't do that. Right. So I've I I have had to come to terms with that, doing the podcast, getting on to Facebook live. Yeah. Even though I'm talking to somebody else. I mean, I know I should be on doing more of my own. Just be on [00:45:30] there. I I've been having that that come to Jesus with myself about Marie. It's OK. You know, so I. I'm glad you brought that up, because I think that there probably. Yeah, it's totally a thing. And I bet there's a lot of women out there listening that actually [00:45:45] feel that same way. So it's I think it's important for others to understand that when they hear the story of somebody who's done everything that you've done, that you've had some of those experiences.
[00:45:55] Oh, my gosh. OK. You know, MFL, that vulnerability. Right. We also really I felt [00:46:00] that going to the White House. So let's talk about the White House now, because on the heels of that and then I want to get into a couple of things.
[00:46:05] Yeah, we cannot we can not get out of this park as well discussing the fact that my friend Catherine was invited to the White House. So shortly as you're coming [00:46:15] out of the Keel's. So this is bombe, the conference, huge success rate bomb, 20 outstanding women in Maine bomb.
[00:46:23] All of a sudden one day your I drive with your husband who has been so weak he wasn't in the car [00:46:30] with, you know, so we were supposed to go to camp and Charlie's all excited about going to camp on Thursday night.
[00:46:37] We're going to leave Friday morning. I packed everything up Thursday night. We wake up Friday morning and he's like, I got work to do. I can't go. And normally [00:46:45] I would have been just the subservient woman and said, I'll stay home with a weekend with my husband and serve my family.
[00:46:54] And I was like, you know what?
[00:46:55] I was really looking forward to going to camp. I'll figure out how to turn. The propane [00:47:00] camp is no electricity. It's propane gets, you know, pee outside. You know, it's camp. It's camp. And I'm like, I am going. I think I freaked my husband out, you know, and he didn't know it was going to say, no, sorry, don't [00:47:15] don't mess with me. I'm going to camp. Bye. And I'm driving a camp. And I met with a girlfriend who just recently lost as an adult son to a drug overdose. If Charlie would have been with me, I wouldn't have had that time with her. So I got to have I got to have time [00:47:30] with her. And people who are grieving just need to be listened to. So I was able to to listen. And then I just I knew that I wasn't going to have service when I got to camp. So I was just checking my smartphone emails, Facebook, you know, look at her. And then I see [00:47:45] this thing from the White House, this email from the White House. And I'm like, what? And it said, you know, please give us a call at your earliest convenience.
[00:47:53] I'm like, why did you think was spam at first or something worse? I did. Who got that? Who got this clever e-mail address? [00:48:00] I always like.
[00:48:01] Okay. Her name is Giovana on its friend. It says dot gov. So there is a phone number on there. And I'm like, OK, I'm on a call it. So I call her and she's like, Hey, we got your name from Victor Veith. Right.
[00:48:14] The [00:48:15] guy from the from the ground fails here. We're very good at it. It is there.
[00:48:21] You know, there are no accidents in life. And so she said we would we're doing a meeting on sex trafficking [00:48:30] and we would respectfully ask that you would come in, be a part of this meeting. Let us know what you're seeing in the world of sex trafficking and bring concrete ideas with you on what you think the federal government can [00:48:45] and should do on sex trafficking and on prevention. And we will be following up with another e-mail to give you more information. But it's October 30th at 1 o'clock.
[00:48:56] So it's like right around the corner, actually, from when it was two weeks away, it [00:49:00] was really like you got that e-mail. I remember seeing a Jaguar video. Yes. And then it then the concrete ideas.
[00:49:07] Oh, my gosh. I need to turn my car around and go home and get busy. Yeah. But I didn't. Good. I I took should stop and [00:49:15] I wanted to, like, let everybody know. So I did a Facebook lie that I totally am like blubbering.
[00:49:21] Why not just go, oh, I'm so grateful.
[00:49:27] And then then then my husband calls [00:49:30] me who says he doesn't pay attention to Facebook. Right. It's it's just for women. It's just older women. Right. He sees it definitely calls me. Yes. I should call my husband first, but I did anyway. So he called me and we're like jumping up and down in our own way. And [00:49:45] then I go to camp good and I spend my two days in camp and I meditate and spend a lot of time in prayer and just please, God, use me as you know. Thank you for you for this opportunity. And [00:50:00] how can I be of service? Please remove, dissolve with grace and ease anything in me that will prevent me from being my highest and best during this opportunity. Please, please, please. Please, please. And went to camp and was there for [00:50:15] a couple of days and and came back down and met with my board and said, OK, here are my concrete ideas.
[00:50:23] What I think I want to present to the White House. And then we had.
[00:50:29] So then Charlie [00:50:30] went with me to Charlie doesn't usually go. My husband doesn't normally go with me to any of my sex trafficking, child sexual abuse prevention, anything, because he cries. He's manly, manly guy. And he'll tell you that it's allergies.
[00:50:46] The [00:50:45] tears are go down. Right.
[00:50:49] And so and that was a total God job because somebody else was supposed to go and there was a conflict. So Charlie came with me and he didn't go into [00:51:00] the White House with me.
[00:51:01] He was afraid that, like church, it would explode if he walked in or something. So he he stayed at the hotel, but he was profoundly changed by by this. He's been hugely supportive this entire time. And we're talking [00:51:15] a lot of money. You know, the non the the lawyers for the nonprofit, I don't get paid to speak. I will in 2020. Can I get it right, man? But so far, how I've been about this is so [00:51:30] passionate. It's like I'm not going to charge this. You know, the school of the Atlanta egg or what? I'm going to lake just, you know, whatever. Go. And so I have spoken for five years. Thousands of people and not just women all over [00:51:45] the country.
[00:51:45] You guys are all over. Yeah. And Charlie pay his own dime. All on my own dime. Charlie. Charlie in yours. Dime. Well, yeah. Well, you guys are. Get married.
[00:51:55] We're married. But I mean he's. He has quietly off paid for. You know, if there's a hotel, [00:52:00] there's a flight. Whatever it is he has covered that I think we've you know, we've we've gotten a little bit of money, but certainly not compared to what you've been putting out of pocket.
[00:52:11] Right.
[00:52:11] So, you know, tens of thousands of dollars and we [00:52:15] get one check from a an advocacy that was closing stock. You know, they were ending their advocacy. We get like seventeen thousand dollars once. Besides that, it's a little old lady hand-writing, very squiggly with a ten dollar bill. [00:52:30] You know, I keep doing God's work, dear.
[00:52:33] But, you know, we got the envelope. I actually know where that comes at. Hearts that are phenomenal. Oh, my gosh. You don't want to, like, deposit the money because you just want to give it back to hers. God bless you. You know, so. [00:52:45]
[00:52:45] So he came with me on this. And so he's you know, he's at the hotel lobby with the senators and congressmen. And in he actually you know, they said, what? You know, why are you here? You know, cause he's dressed in Maynor clothes [00:53:00] and they're in suits and ties. And and the. And he would say, my wife is. It was invited to the White House to talk about sex trafficking. And their response from the other manly, manly men was just it [00:53:15] melted him. They were they were just like, God bless your wife. Thank you for what you're doing.
[00:53:21] And he was like, Yeah, that's how I roll. Oh, yeah. I thought I was.
[00:53:27] So that that was really that was really cool. [00:53:30] And then at the White House, experience was was phenomenal. Getting inside the White House is crazy. The security is is is crazy. There's, you know, a line of, you [00:53:45] know, 28 year olds with machine guns and and everything like this vicious.
[00:53:51] This shit's getting real. She said she walked it. Right. This is getting this is getting real.
[00:53:56] And, you know, first that morning, the 30th, I met with Senator Collins, [00:54:00] first at at her her office in Washington, D.C. And that was amazing.
[00:54:08] And she's our senator for me. She's our senator. And she.
[00:54:12] And wow, she she was different than how [00:54:15] she seems on the commercials. She was just petite and feminine and engaging and intelligent and soft spoken and kind. You shared your full attention. Her assistant interrupted three times, saying, [00:54:30] your next person is here. And she said, I'm. I appreciate that. Tell them to please wait. She was just fully present with me. And how in a really interested in the sex trafficking issue, as everyone is in Washington, D.C., it's a big deal to [00:54:45] hear.
[00:54:45] Huge deal. So it's hitting. It's it's becoming. People are paying attention. This is their fourth.
[00:54:52] This is their fourth year of doing that. Like what? When I was a part of. So there became a bill, anti-trafficking [00:55:00] bill in 2020. The White House, this is their fourth year. They just established a few weeks ago a survival council. And this is what you were. And so I was asked to be on this. So I will have the opportunity to go [00:55:15] back on a regular basis. And participate in what?
[00:55:19] Yeah. Yeah.
[00:55:22] So this was not a one hit wonder. This was. Oh, yeah. I mean, so you you've been you've been given a seat at the table and been asked [00:55:30] excuse me to not just be seen in.
[00:55:33] Well so they're very clear that the twenty ninth we had a conference call, there were 53 different people on the conference call with the White House talking about sex trafficking and child pornography. It's a it's [00:55:45] way where I knew it was really, really, really bad. It's even worse than I had imagined. And then the morning I met with Senator Collins and then I'm going to the White House, they want you to start the process a half an hour early just to get through [00:56:00] all the security measures. So I made a mistake on my on my application. It has to be perfect. There can't be one letter missing. It has to be absolute or they will not let you in the building. And [00:56:15] I accidentally said I was born in 1965 instead of 1964. I just made a mistake. I I like went through it three times because they said if you make a mistake, you [00:56:30] will not be allowed in the White House girl.
[00:56:32] I mean, no. And they say no typos. Going through security. It's not exact.
[00:56:39] You at you're out of here. So here's 30 people who had no problem going [00:56:45] through security. They did everything right. And here I am, the only survivor. And I screw up. And Giovana. They were fantastic. They were like. We'll fix that. So they pull up my application. They fix it. They send it back down to security. Security [00:57:00] is, you know, very serious with the machine guns.
[00:57:03] So. So I walked. I walked in. I walked in five.
[00:57:07] And I was escorted into the Roosevelt ROOM, by the way, the Roosevelt ROOM in the White House. The door to the right of the fireplace [00:57:15] lead you into the Oval Office. I mean, I'm in the West Wing. Yeah. You're out of the White House. You're there. So they escort me in and everybody's sitting there. And it's this long, dark conference table. Beautiful room, an American flag. And all [00:57:30] these people with these placemats, you know, like your name or you're gonna sit. And I was energetically you want to be right in the middle. And I was so I was right there. And next to the person who works, [00:57:45] who answers directly to the president of the United States on human trafficking. And then all these other people were different advocates who do national and international work around trafficking and child prevention, who had a lot to say [00:58:00] about the refugee camps and stuff. Awful, awful, awful. So they're all sharing now. I'm saying this because as a woman, normally my inner dialogue would have been you screwed up. Look, you're not worthy. You can't [00:58:15] even fill out the damn application. How are you going to share anything of value when you can't even fill the damn application? Right. Everybody else did it. Okay. You are unworthy to be at this table. And I would [00:58:30] have I would have punished. I would have done a self-imposed punishment by not allowing myself to talk because who am I? I just disrespected every person in that room by not doing my part correctly. [00:58:45]
[00:58:45] And by entering that meeting five minutes late, I would have sat in my chair and probably would have sat not on the table. I would have taken a chair against the wall instead of my place at the table. Took [00:59:00] your place at the table, but I took my place at the table. And I'm like, you have one opportunity, right, cause I hadn't asked me for anything at this point. You have one opportunity to represent that the hundreds of thousands [00:59:15] of people who've been sexually abused. You have an obligation to prevent any more. The children today deserve to have a childhood on stained by molestation and all [00:59:30] the domino effect that falls after it. You put your own crap away. Sit in this seat and tell them what your recommendations are. And so I did it. Or I would have apologized. I didn't apologize. Good. [00:59:45] I sat there and when it was my turn to give my recommendations, I looked in the eyes of every single one of those 30 people at that table and said, here is what I believe needs to be done nationally on [01:00:00] this issue. And then I shut up. And then at the end, all the people were like networking, you know, like a BNA meeting or networking.
[01:00:14] And I [01:00:15] turned to the two White House employees and said, I want to do more. How can I be of service? I really love education and prevention. What can I do? Please know that I am at your service.
[01:00:30] So [01:00:30] I ask for what I wanted.
[01:00:32] And the one woman said, I have already written you an email and my imagination. You will be receiving an e-mail. Look for me. We would love to have you on our survival council moving forward. And that was you [01:00:45] did a wonderful job. Loved what you had to share. And then other people said, you know, thank you. You really shared great staff. And I let go of all my negative stuff. And then when I went outside, they were doing pictures and I made my [01:01:00] made my way out of. They escort you quickly. Take pictures here. Walk down these stairs.
[01:01:06] Take a picture here. OK, bye. Did the door hit you in the back by. And when I went out, my husband was there waiting for me at the gate.
[01:01:15] And [01:01:15] I had had, you know, a little kitten heels and not a high heel, but it just a, you know, an elegant heel.
[01:01:21] And and he had my sneakers because we had a I thought he had Mycenae. Charlie doesn't do stuff like that. He had my sneakers there. So I would be comfortable walking [01:01:30] back to the hut that fit, you know, like.
[01:01:33] So there you go. That's such a so. So what just happened and where would this has been spent? A phenomenal conversation. We're going to have to start to wrap things up, which I hate [01:01:45] to do. I could go on and on with you for probably like 10 or can we just stay till cocktails? All right. I'm sorry. This is great. This is wonderful. Don't do it.
[01:01:56] I know I did. I did. My daughters change. No [01:02:00] apologies necessary. So clever.
[01:02:05] There were some really great lessons for daughters change in this entire podcast, but particularly that last story. You did not apologize for being who you were for [01:02:15] a mistake that anybody could have made. You took your seat at the table. You spoke your truth and looked everybody in the eye. I mean, you. And you asked for what you wanted for at the end. And you got that. So [01:02:30] you now have a seat at the table. And we need more daughters of change with seats at the table. So kudos to you. Thank you. So I want to. Obviously, there are a lot of ways that people can connect and support you, [01:02:45] whether it's through donations or speaking engagements, paid speaking engagements for 2020. We are going to make sure, Catherine, that all of that information is in the show notes. But do you want to just quickly give us your your [01:03:00] Web site? We can say it out loud and I will make sure it's in there.
[01:03:03] Yeah. Stop trafficking. You asked. Dot org is the Web site and the goal for 2020 is to we have a new board member who's with the PR firm. So I need to get on the circuit to [01:03:15] be a paid speaker at the conferences that they have. That is definitely a goal. The other thing is to get every faith based organization across the state of Maine to update their policies and procedures around how to keep kids safe [01:03:30] in their building. And that was sort of the charge that Victor Veith gave us. That's that is huge. And then, of course, the using our own hometown heroes to do short educational educational videos for our community. [01:03:45] So those are the three tasks at hand.
[01:03:48] And those are three things that you could use help and support with whatever way, whether it's connections. Somebody wants to volunteer somebody that knows somebody and turns, I take it. I could use some interns. OK, so that's great, too. So intern opportunities [01:04:00] were too huge. This is a great thing to put on your as. Absolutely. People, right? So they stopped trafficking us, dawg. And through there, they can connect with you directly. Absolutely. Now, you also have. Let's just quickly, because you're very active on social [01:04:15] media. So you have your Catherine and Wilson.
[01:04:18] That's my personal page. Those are usually Sunraysia sign rises and doggie video. OK. And then stop trafficking U.S.. Yeah, that's. And so I'm I'm on stop trafficking. U.S. is [01:04:30] on Instagram. It's on Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn.
[01:04:35] Ok. So people can find you. Well, measurer that. That's in the show, notes Catherine. Before we sign off, any final words?
[01:04:42] Be the change.
[01:04:46] Thank [01:04:45] you for listening to this week's episode of the Daughters of Change podcast. To learn more about today's guest or any of our previous guests, you can visit Daughters of Change dot com forward slash podcast. You can [01:05:00] connect with Daughters of Change on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram by searching those platforms for Daughters of Change. If you are a daughter of change yourself and would like to appear on the show, send me an email at Marae at. Daughters of Change [01:05:15] dot com. Thanks again for taking the time to listen today. Take care.